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 11 
 on: July 26, 2014, 11:10:09 PM 
Started by Kings_kid - Last post by BigOrange
  Oh,it's still alive & kicking in many circles,unfortunately. Sad

 Just met and spoke with a pastor friend this morning who stated that he absolutely believes in a hekk of eternal conscious suffering.

 I came home,and just ordered Edward Fudge's book,The Fire that Consumes........vee shall seE!!/ huh


 Vera Lee~ Afro

Fantastic!  I have heard about Fudge's book, but never took the opportunity to buy it.  I hear it is long, but I would be glad to discuss it with you, if you are willing.

Yippee!
Fudge book arriVed t0day...just getting iNt0 iT!!/ cool

 12 
 on: July 26, 2014, 03:05:03 PM 
Started by Kings_kid - Last post by Kings_kid
Book still not here... huh

 ...but I did stay @ a Holiday Inn Express last night,not really cheesy....and found this!!/  cool

 http://www.mercifultruth.com/eternity.html


That article starts out well, but quickly turns to "universalism".  Which would be fine if that were clearly stated in Scripture. 

Unfortunately, it doesn't  seem to occur to the author that his questions have a different answer if "conditional immortality" is true, which i believe the Bible actually says.  I'll take a closer look and see if he later deals with that subject. 

One thing i notice is that he separates immortality from eternal Life, and that is true until the Resurrection of Believers.  But having unending Life is to be connected to Jesus, the Source of Life, and to be granted immortality by Him when He comes for us.  Yet, the lost reject His Life and His salvation, even unto the Second Death, which doesn't end.

Immortality is to be given a living body continuously, by God approving of, and maintaining, the existence of the person's form non-stop, forever.  Yet, the lost are never said to be given immortality in Scripture, rather they are given "eternal destruction" -- and even if we translate that as "for ages of ages", there is no mention in the Bible of a later resurrection after the Second Death, the final End, is administered.

 13 
 on: July 26, 2014, 02:56:16 PM 
Started by makahiya - Last post by Kings_kid

Since, as the "Some errors in the beloved KJV" topic shows, there have been many changes (over 700) in the meanings of english words since KJV times, it seems reasonable to use multiple translations, including an updated version of the KJV.

The fully-inspired Word of God is contained in the original hebrew and greek documents which He directly inspired.  We are better off not worshipping any particular translation, but asking the Holy Spirit to lead us in our choices of versions to study.  And He doesn't just speak KJ english...

 14 
 on: July 26, 2014, 02:49:54 PM 
Started by makahiya - Last post by Kings_kid

Using Scripture to try to belittle someone doesn't answer the question i raised:



I think you missed the question i was raising.  Can you see any major differences between the KJV and the ESV in the verses you cited?  Is the ESV "another gospel"?  I think not.
...

 15 
 on: July 26, 2014, 02:46:52 PM 
Started by BFDD - Last post by Kings_kid

One thing their "statements of faith" seem to make clear is that they believe that true Christians are completely sin-free, here and now, and only perfectly holy Believers will be saved.  Makes Heaven sound pretty empty.

 16 
 on: July 26, 2014, 02:38:27 PM 
Started by anaya999 - Last post by Kings_kid

Oh.  I thought you might be a "bad-smitten" kind of guy.   cool

 17 
 on: July 26, 2014, 02:38:22 PM 
Started by savedbygrace - Last post by savedbygrace
Adam must sin for the simple fact that this World was Created for a Redemptive Purpose in Christ Jesus, Its called the Eternal Purpose in Christ Jesus Eph 3:11

11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

In this, everything was made or created for Christ Jesus Per Col 1:16

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

Adam was Created for Him, Jesus Christ was the First and Primary cause why Adam was Created.

Again not only was all things made by but for Him, the Earth was Established and founded in Wisdom Prov 3:19

The Lord by wisdom hath founded the earth; by understanding hath he established the heavens.

Christ is the Power and Wisdom of God 1 Cor 1:24

24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.

When Adam was formed and placed in the Earth, it was Very Good, for he was made according to the Infinite Wisdom of God and in the best possible state in execution for the accomplishment of the Work of Redemption Christ was set up unto from Eternity, Christ had an Eye to that in these Words leading to the Cross Jn 17:4

4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

The Earth here is that same one of Prov 3:19

19 The Lord by wisdom hath founded the earth; by understanding hath he established the heavens.

That Work that the Father gave Him to do was that of Redemption, for Redemption and Wisdom go together 1 Cor 1:30

30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

When God finished Creation Gen 1-2, hence all things had been made in the best possible state that Divine Wisdom could contrive, to expedite the Cross Work of the Lord Jesus Christ;

And so all men in Adam from the very beginning were made for Jesus Christ and a Redemptive Purpose that would magnify the Grace and Wisdom of God Eph 2:7

7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.

Eph 3:8-11

8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;

9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,

11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

You see that in Eph 3:8 ? In Adam's Creation God had an Eye to the Preaching of the Gospel to the Gentiles of the Unsearchable Riches of Christ ! 92

 18 
 on: July 26, 2014, 02:35:47 PM 
Started by makahiya - Last post by Kings_kid
 
It's interesting that almost half of the versions i checked specify the three "Witnesses" in verse 7, but many do not, though they are specified in verse 8.  

 19 
 on: July 25, 2014, 05:15:50 PM 
Started by BFDD - Last post by Lone Arranger
Quote
If that is true then stop telling your 5 year olds to behave. Stop thinking they should obey you and not play with snakes and cobras in the busy street. They're just going to do what comes natural...evil! If Christians or any people can't be moral then just accept lying, cheating, murder and adultery. Open the prisons because those criminals could just as easily be you or I.  They couldn't help being bad.
Those things are about getting alone with others, and I'm not saying people can't learn to behave - at least sometimes; but being moral is different than behaving.  Moral is from the heart, and man is simply unable to consistently be moral or good.  Anyone who thinks otherwise lives in a fantasy world.

Now as to Calvanism, I'm not a Calvinist - I've stated that several times.  I am just clear in theology that no one but Christ fulfilled the law, and that faith in Him is the only way to salvation, morality, righteousness.  All man's endeavors are vanity.     

 20 
 on: July 25, 2014, 07:58:51 AM 
Started by BFDD - Last post by THOR
Quote
when the real issue is that no one can be moral.  It's a literal impossibility for any human

If that is true then stop telling your 5 year olds to behave. Stop thinking they should obey you and not play with snakes and cobras in the busy street. They're just going to do what comes natural...evil! If Christians or any people can't be moral then just accept lying, cheating, murder and adultery. Open the prisons because those criminals could just as easily be you or I.  They couldn't help being bad.

I know there seems to be some moral good people but somehow they are faking it!
Jesus was a joker and when He said "if you love me keep my Commandments", He meant spiritually, as in 'not keeping the commandments'.

Actually the New Testament is very plain about faith and actions unless you are Reform Theology and only focus on two or three NT verses.  I went to a reform church for years and they religiously avoided any verses that did not agree with Calvinism and became very nervous when I would point out conflicting scripture. You can't practice unrepentant, unconfessed sin and be saved. Jesus gives us the 'power' to obey Him.

Thor  cool

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